[tex-live] Perl for Windows

[Jerzy B. Ludwichowski]

David Kastrup:
> If you move off a scroll bar horizontally accidentally while dragging,
> it does not jump back?  You can just copy the home directory tree of a
> user that is currently active without XP balking out and aborting
> because the user's registry is open?  If you "View properties" of a
> file or link, the dialog can be made to display the whole path of the
> file without getting cut off?
>
> Congratulations.
>
>   
Sarcasm is not what should be used here to make a point. Each and every 
operating system and user interface (especially visual) has it's 
deficiencies, at least for those who are not at home with them. 
Otherwise what point would there be in the constant strive to improve 
them? I feel at home in my home which doesn't mean that it is perfectly 
organized and have problems when being somewhere else -- it takes me 
time to get used and find my ways around what I perceive as deficiencies 
and such.

>>> No, a lot of things are quite inconvenient under Windows by design.
>>> And I don't understand why they keep them time and again, or even
>>> make them worse.
>>>   
>>>       
>> hm, if windows's design is so bad, then why do so many linux gui
>> things try to mimick it ... (or the macs)

See above. Various things are getting cross-mimicked as these become 
slowly a common want for users.

>> (btw, you don't want to know how often i can get x windows to crash,
>>     
>
> The topic was user interface, not code quality.
>
>   
Oh no! Code quality is closely related to design quality.
>> the whole point in such things is that one, once one is accustomed
>> to a system, intuitively gets to know what to avoid / not use), but,
>> as said, it's a pointless discussion and a matter of taste, we could
>> as well be talking about music .. are the musical capabilities of
>> your prefered performers better than mine?
>>     
>
> I was not talking about matters of taste.  The deficiencies I
> described have no redeeming purpose whatsoever.  They are inconvenient
> and nothing else.
>
>   
Matters of taste do matter. What is TL about?  I think that it is about 
getting TeX being used by as wide as possible audience. Nobody can claim 
that there are no Windows  users, so instead of whining that Windows is 
bad and fighting flame wars about Christmas being a better holiday than, 
e.g., July 4th, let us concentrate to making a good product.
>> btw. isn't the nice thing that, because tex is portable, one can
>> choose whatever os is around? discussions about os, editor and
>> everything else that is needed are always related to personal taste;
>> actually, it would be more fun if we had some 50 operating systems)
>>     
>
> There are more than 50 operating systems easily.  I know no GUI and OS
> except that of Windows (and maybe MSDOS) with those problems I
> described and which hit me just because I had to work for a few hours
> with it.
>
>   
Nobody forces nobody -- except for circumstances -- to use Windows. But, 
if we want Windows users to use TeX, lets get on with the jobof 
providing convenient TL packaging for WIndows. BTW. please have a look at:

http://www.unicode.org/notes/tn28/UTN28-PlainTextMath.pdf

-- this might be perceived as a problem for our community: this is 
already shipped by MS with Office 2007 Beta -- and it works...

> If you prefer to consider the package as a whole worth having, that's
> your privilege and a matter of taste.  But declaring clear
> deficiencies as a matter of taste or non-existent does not make sense.
>
> And no, nobody mimicks _those_, and for good reason.
>   
Again, Windows users are important to our community.

Jerzy Ludwichowski
Polish TeX Users Group, president