<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
</head>
<body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">
Hi Jean-François,<br class="">
<div><br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On 16 Feb 2021, at 8:08 am, jfbu <<a href="mailto:jfbu@free.fr" class="">jfbu@free.fr</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">
Hi Ross,
<div class=""><br class="">
<div class="">
<div class="">Le 15 févr. 2021 à 21:14, Ross Moore <<a href="mailto:ross.moore@mq.edu.au" class="">ross.moore@mq.edu.au</a>> a écrit :</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
… and all this extra noise would just turn off most users anyway.</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br class="">
</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
Serious users, who are aware of how useful the .log file really is,</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
should have the ability to make adjustments for themselves.</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br class="">
</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
You can always put the directive:</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
\tracinglostchars2</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
in your preamble.</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
It doesn’t need to be a LaTeX default.</div>
</blockquote>
<br class="">
</div>
</div>
<div class="">I mentioned LaTeX, which was my mistake because</div>
<div class="">it was not a latex question on this why I did not address</div>
<div class="">it to the latex team ; however it is relevant to LaTeX</div>
<div class="">as typically LaTeX produces tons of log output</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>It sure does!</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>But it is not even close to what you get when using \tracingall </div>
<div>to try to diagnose why something is going wrong, when developing</div>
<div>macros to do complicated things.</div>
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">what I was trying to say is that both</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">\tracinglostchars1</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">and</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">\tracinglostchars2</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">are lacking imho in usefulness because, whether to terminal</div>
<div class="">or to the log, their output might easily go unnoticed,</div>
<div class="">and it is very important indeed what they try to tell the user</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">sure, if you get a whole bunch of 20 of them in a row,</div>
<div class="">you might see them in console output, but if you have</div>
<div class="">only one such warning and are building a 200 pages document</div>
<div class="">which nowadays is faster than 20 years ago,</div>
<div class="">the stdout stream flashes bye so quick, you might not </div>
<div class="">see it</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>True.</div>
<div>That’s why you have command-line tools like grep </div>
<div>to find strings within a file.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>Or open the .log within a text editor and use its ‘Find' facility.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>Using TeXshop on a Mac, the Console window is searchable</div>
<div>once a job has completed.</div>
<div>(But that’s not going to show you Missing Characters.</div>
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">hence my query for a stronger behavior which would</div>
<div class="">be to add to both stdout and the log file a one-line</div>
<div class="">warning at end of run</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">either that, or a </div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">\tracinglostchars3</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">which would trigger that</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">it would match then with some other</div>
<div class="">of etex report mechanisms</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>If you are using a script, e.g. to run LaTeX multiple times,</div>
<div>then build the index and run again, etc. ...</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>… just add an appropriate grep line to look for</div>
<div>infelicities that you know you care about.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>Making changes in the TeX engine has to be done with great care.</div>
<div>People have built work-flows assuming the engine behaves in a particular way.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>Changing this, however small, can then affect those work-flows in ways</div>
<div>that are not likely to be easily predictable.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>As a mathematician, I always say that there’s more than one way to tackle</div>
<div>any given problem or exercise.</div>
<div>One’s first attempt is generally not the best way, which will only become</div>
<div>apparent after several trials and failures.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>So too in Computer Programming. </div>
<div>With a complex system like TeX/LaTeX there are many approaches that</div>
<div>can be considered, utilising many different tools.</div>
<div>Your text editor is a vital part of this, and it can be used in imaginative ways.</div>
<br class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Thanks,</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Jean-François</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br class="">
</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div>Hope the helps.</div>
<div><br class="">
</div>
<div><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"></span>Ross</div>
<br class="">
<div class=""><br class="">
Dr Ross Moore<br class="">
Department of Mathematics and Statistics
<div class="">12 Wally’s Walk, Level 7, Room 734<br class="">
Macquarie University, NSW 2109, Australia<br class="">
T: +61 2 9850 8955 | F: +61 2 9850 8114<br class="">
M:+61 407 288 255 | E: <a href="mailto:ross.moore@mq.edu.au" class="">ross.moore@mq.edu.au</a><br class="">
<a href="http://www.maths.mq.edu.au" class="">http://www.maths.mq.edu.au</a><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: normal;"><a href="http://mq.edu.au/" target="_blank" style="font-size: 12px; line-height: normal;" class=""><span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 105, 217); color: rgb(0, 105, 217); font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; orphans: 2; widows: 2;">
<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 105, 217); color: rgb(0, 105, 217); font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-family: Arial, sans-serif; orphans: 2; widows: 2;"><span><span><span><span><img apple-inline="yes" id="38F5BB92-8FFE-4CE8-9F5C-9644D81BAB07" src="cid:image001.png@01D030BE.D37A46F0" class=""></span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">CRICOS
Provider Number 00002J. Think before you</span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">print. </span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Please
consider the environment before printing this</span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">email.</span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">This
message is intended for the addressee named</span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">and
may </span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">contain
confidential information. If you are not the</span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">intended </span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">recipient,
please delete it and notify the sender. Views</span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">expressed </span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">in
this message are those of the individual sender, and</span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">are
not </span><br style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">necessarily
the views of Macquarie University.</span> </span></span></span></span></span></a></span></div>
<a href="http://mq.edu.au/" target="_blank" style="font-size: 12px; line-height: normal;" class=""></a></div>
<br class="">
</body>
</html>