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<DIV><FONT face="Arial Unicode MS">Ah, we differ. I know John Bowley (who
is still alive) had that experience with a long stretch of Syriac - possibly in
the Journal of Theological Studies but I'm not sure, and I couldn't name the
author in question.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Arial Unicode MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Arial Unicode MS">Ross, the Aristotelian scholar, was shocked
to discover that the compositors didn't know Greek when asked to clarify
something in his appalling handwritten copy. He had been submitting
handwritten Greek editions of Aristotle for years with precious little to
correct on the galleys (but then proofs were overread by one of the 'learned
readers' before authors ever got to see the compositor's work).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Arial Unicode MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Arial Unicode MS"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="Arial Unicode MS">John</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=wujastyk@gmail.com href="mailto:wujastyk@gmail.com">Dominik
Wujastyk</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=xetex@tug.org
href="mailto:xetex@tug.org">Unicode-based TeX for Mac OS X and other
platforms</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> 23 October 2010 17:55</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [XeTeX] (Xe)LaTeX output in
a non-(Xe)LaTeX scholarly community</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>That was Prof. Max Muller (professor of Philology) and his
critical edition of the Rg Veda. :-)<BR><BR>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On 23 October 2010 18:41, Gareth Hughes <SPAN
dir=ltr><<A
href="mailto:garzohugo@gmail.com">garzohugo@gmail.com</A>></SPAN>
wrote:<BR>
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class=gmail_quote>On the matter of declining skills in typesetting I'm
reminded of an<BR>Oxford apocryphon of a printer who was preparing a
Sanskrit grammar. The<BR>printer contacted the author, an esteemed
professor, with a crucial<BR>error in the Sanskrit text. The professor first
felt angry at being<BR>questioned on matters of Sanskrit by a printer, but
verified the<BR>reported the error in his own copy. Returning to the printer
he asked<BR>how he'd managed to spot the error. The printer replied that,
after<BR>setting pages and pages in a script he could not read, he had
learnt<BR>that one of them never follows one of them! Ah... attention to
detail;<BR>they don't make them like that anymore!<BR><FONT
color=#888888><BR>Gareth.<BR></FONT>
<DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=h5><BR>John Was wrote:<BR>> Well I'm still in the Press once a
week at least (for choir practice!)<BR>> so I shall make sure these
comments reach the right ears. They<BR>> correspond, unfortunately
to my own impression. Leofranc<BR>> Holford-Strevens works
heroically on critical editions but he is the<BR>> sole in-house editor
left and can't possibly handle them all. I think<BR>> he is pretty
well full-time on large projects with extensive commentary<BR>> (and
still finds time to publish and lecture extensively on an<BR>>
astonishing range of topics).<BR>><BR>> Getting back to TeX-related
matters, the hyphenation patterns available<BR>> in XeTeX (even to
'plain' users like myself) are an enormous help, even<BR>> if I disagree
with the English at frequent points (the Latin rarely lets<BR>> me down,
aside from a few rogues - is hucusque one? - which I guess are<BR>>
analagous to Knuth's 'manuscript' in refusing to comply with the<BR>>
algorithms). No one bothers to read people like Priscian on what
should<BR>> be done with Greek and Latin, and no one at OUP involved in
passing<BR>> proofs would have the faintest idea about this subject.
Neither, alas,<BR>> do authors - with the Dictionary of Medieval
Latin (which I have just<BR>> relinquished with completion of Fascicule
XIII in the middle of letter<BR>> 'R') it was left entirely to me, and I
fear that laxity in this matter<BR>> will pervade future fascicules as it
did in some of those that preceded<BR>> my involvement. When I
asked the compilers to keep a look-out for any<BR>> bad
hyphenations that I might have missed in perusing and correcting the<BR>>
proofs, they asked me to explain the rules!<BR>><BR>>
John<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> ----- Original Message ----- From:
<<A
href="mailto:jherrman@allegheny.edu">jherrman@allegheny.edu</A>><BR>>
To: <<A href="mailto:xetex@tug.org">xetex@tug.org</A>><BR>> Sent:
23 October 2010 15:05<BR>> Subject: Re: [XeTeX] (Xe)LaTeX output in a
non-(Xe)LaTeX scholarly<BR>> community<BR>><BR>><BR>>> Yes,
as you would guess, the copy-editor marked up my files by hand<BR>>>
and sent me the hard copy.<BR>>><BR>>> Recent OUP critical
editions in Greek prose could use a lot more<BR>>> copy-editing; I
would assert that their production standards in this<BR>>> area have
fallen drastically in the last decade. We have new editions<BR>>> of
the Greek orators Demosthenes and Lysias in the Oxford Classical<BR>>>
Text series, all filled with rampant flaws in hyphenation and
line<BR>>> numbering in the apparatus. Reviews have also identified
numerous<BR>>> slips of a more substantial nature, that seem to
suggest very little<BR>>> copy-editing is happening on these in house.
It seems that OUP has<BR>>> adopted new modes of production for these
critical editions that<BR>>> create these problems, and authors (and
copy-editors?) don't regularly<BR>>> take the time to fix it all. I
know in the case of my book the<BR>>> copy-editor, who was otherwise
very attentive, didn't seem to have<BR>>> looked at the Greek at
all.<BR>>><BR>>> The other major series of critical texts in
Greek (and Latin), on the<BR>>> other hand, the Bibliotheca
Teubneriana, has been shuffled from one<BR>>> publisher to another in
the last decade. It's now in the hands of De<BR>>> Gruyter, who seems
devoted to its revitalization. They're requiring<BR>>> all editors to
submit camera-ready-copy, and recommending that they<BR>>> use
Critical Edition Typesetter (<<A href="http://www.karas.ch/cet/"
target=_blank>http://www.karas.ch/cet/</A>>). I have<BR>>> the
impression they only really care about the appearance of the
CRC,<BR>>> though, and wouldn't really care if authors prefer other
typesetting<BR>>> systems.<BR>>><BR>>> Jud
Herrman<BR>>><BR>>><BR>>> On 2010-10-23, John
Was<BR>>> <<A
href="mailto:john.was@ntlworld.com">john.was@ntlworld.com</A>>
wrote:<BR>>>> OUP will normally be amenable if saving money is in
prospect! I<BR>>>> think the<BR>>>> barrier here has
always been the copy-editing process (now more<BR>>>>
vulnerable<BR>>>> since house style is not seen as so important and
indeed there is no<BR>>>> longer<BR>>>> any copy-editing
department at OUP). A critical edition will normally<BR>>>>
require a rather small amount of copy-editing, though there is still
the<BR>>>> introduction and commentary to consider - but if a
TeX-savvy author is<BR>>>> willing to implement those copy-editing
changes and suggestions s/he<BR>>>> agrees<BR>>>> with,
there is no real difficulty. The copy-editor would
then<BR>>>> presumably<BR>>>> work by pen(cil) on a draft
PDF printout in the traditional way (or by<BR>>>> annotating the
PDF electronically, which can be tedious).<BR>>>><BR>>>>
Or of course one can simply trust the author not to make any mistakes
at<BR>>>> all, and forgo copy-editing. Even twenty years ago
this was<BR>>>> mentioned as a<BR>>>> possibility at OUP
but no one dared to do it in my time there.<BR>>>><BR>>>>
But I hope this doesn't become too much of a trend or I'll have
to<BR>>>> look for<BR>>>> something else to do! In
the meantime, I must dust down my old brown<BR>>>> OCT
of<BR>>>> Hyperides...<BR>>>><BR>>>>
John<BR><BR><BR>--------------------------------------------------<BR>Subscriptions,
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